Are Christians being logically fallacious?

[Johan Biemans (jbiemans)]

So you are ok with accepting multiple mutually exclusive options at the same time ?

[Rostos]

It doesn't Rostos.  It makes a universal claim that is applicable to everyone, theists and atheists alike that you shall know them by their fruits.  Atheists look at the actions of believers because the scriptures say that you can judge Christians by their actions, right ?

Yeah, what is the problem with that? What does that even have to do with the OP?

The OP is about the actions of Christians.

As i said above, where does Jesus instruct his followers to commit terrorist acts?

[bdsimon]

So you are ok with accepting multiple mutually exclusive options at the same time ?

That's probably not how I would phrase it. I think what I would say (and have consistently said for the 8 or so years I have been posting here) is that I am not very dogmatic about very much in the Bible. So I am willing to except that I could be wrong about passages. It doesn't cause me any internal conflict to think God could call some through faith alone and others will be known for the works that their faith has produced. Some will be inspired to worship only on Saturday and some will insist that you go swimming in order to be saved.

If I am not saved by the grace of God through the shed blood of Christ then I am out of luck and I guess I will just ask for mercy. In the meantime, I will do my best to love my God and my neighbor. That's what I have been asked to do and I see that as pretty cool.

[Johan Biemans (jbiemans)]

It doesn't Rostos.  It makes a universal claim that is applicable to everyone, theists and atheists alike that you shall know them by their fruits.  Atheists look at the actions of believers because the scriptures say that you can judge Christians by their actions, right ?

Yeah, what is the problem with that? What does that even have to do with the OP?

The OP is about the actions of Christians.

As i said above, where does Jesus instruct his followers to commit terrorist acts?

I don't know why I respond to you when this is generally how our conversations go......

[Kalamity]

The utter confusion created by heresies is evident in this thread. We have views spanning the full spectrum of possibilities. As JB notes, we have people happy to embrace mutually exclusive options; we have an implicit admission that either Scripture is so ambiguous that very few can agree on even the requirements for salvation, or that it is just plain contradictory. And yet, apparently, God willed for Scripture to be a primary means for people to come to knowledge of the truth. And the Mormons and JWs have yet to arrive...

Or perhaps God foresaw such an absurd situation and appointed an arbitrator, like is done in every other aspect of human life in which communities form.

[Language-Gamer]

The utter confusion created by heresies is evident in this thread. We have views spanning the full spectrum of possibilities. As JB notes, we have people happy to embrace mutually exclusive options; we have an implicit admission that either Scripture is so ambiguous that very few can agree on even the requirements for salvation, or that it is just plain contradictory. And yet, apparently, God willed for Scripture to be a primary means for people to come to knowledge of the truth. And the Mormons and JWs have yet to arrive...

Or perhaps God foresaw such an absurd situation and appointed an arbitrator, like is done in every other aspect of human life in which communities form.

And for that we thank the Eastern Orthodox Church.

[Lion IRC]

The utter confusion created by heresies is evident in this thread. We have views spanning the full spectrum of possibilities....

True, but the one thing ALL true (Scottish) Christians would agree on is that God is the ultimate arbiter.

Yes we debate doctrinal issues passionately because they are important and they really do matter. No matter how heretical we might find a certain doctrine to be, we all agree that there IS such a thing as a True Christian and that the standard is set by God not humans.

Also, Jesus gives us ample scripture about whether one 'Scotsman' ought to be judging whether another Scotsman is the real deal.

[Johan Biemans (jbiemans)]

How do you know that you are a true Scotsman yourself?

[Lion IRC]

First we have to decide whether there IS such a thing as a true Scotsman.
I think there is.

Do you agree that 2 or more Scotsmen might agree with each other that they both are?

[Kalamity]

How do you know that you are a true Scotsman yourself?

You cannot know you will go to Heaven. You can have varying degrees of confidence and hope (even to the point of living with great joy and anticipation of Heaven), but you cannot know. If I knew, I wouldn't need to await my particular judgment; I could just declare myself saved.

[Hawke123]

The utter confusion created by heresies is evident in this thread. We have views spanning the full spectrum of possibilities. As JB notes, we have people happy to embrace mutually exclusive options; we have an implicit admission that either Scripture is so ambiguous that very few can agree on even the requirements for salvation, or that it is just plain contradictory. And yet, apparently, God willed for Scripture to be a primary means for people to come to knowledge of the truth. And the Mormons and JWs have yet to arrive...

Or perhaps God foresaw such an absurd situation and appointed an arbitrator, like is done in every other aspect of human life in which communities form.

Who might that arbitrator be?

[Kalamity]

The utter confusion created by heresies is evident in this thread. We have views spanning the full spectrum of possibilities. As JB notes, we have people happy to embrace mutually exclusive options; we have an implicit admission that either Scripture is so ambiguous that very few can agree on even the requirements for salvation, or that it is just plain contradictory. And yet, apparently, God willed for Scripture to be a primary means for people to come to knowledge of the truth. And the Mormons and JWs have yet to arrive...

Or perhaps God foresaw such an absurd situation and appointed an arbitrator, like is done in every other aspect of human life in which communities form.

Who might that arbitrator be?

If, like me, you consider it evident that such an authority is necessary, then you should look for viable candidates. How many candidates are there, bold enough in their confidence to make such a claim? Out of these, how many can offer a reasonable defence for their claim? Maybe it will take some time to pray, discern, and decide.